EXCLUSIVE INTERVIEW‘Companies need hearts and brains’
Buddhism, economics and management are all interconnected. The Dalai
Lama believes the financial crisis is a moral crisis. Jörg Eigendorf
spoke with the Tibetan spiritual leader in his Indian exile.
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| Tibetan spiritual leader His Holiness the Dalai Lama spoke to WELT ONLINE in an exclusive interview |
WELT ONLINE: In your opinion the free market isn’t performing well, and you also don’t believe in regulation. So what it is that we need?
Dalai Lama:
I call it a “responsible free market economy”. In the end it comes down
to every single individual; it is dependent on each individual’s sense
of moral responsibility, self-discipline, and values. This financial
crisis isn’t purely a crisis of the market economy, but rather a crisis
of values.
Alright, so the first thing we must do is send all government
leaders and chief executives of large companies to Buddhist convents so
that they may learn self-discipline and gain some morals.
Dalai Lama:
(laughs): Three-week seminars in our convents won’t achieve much. It
would be like laying a piece of ice on a rock – a little while later
the rock would be wet, but nothing more. The rock will still be there.
No, it’s unrealistic to expect a rapid systematic change in the global
economy. The changes need to happen within each individual person and
within the companies. This is dependent on the efforts we make in
people’s education; this is about beginning in Kindergarten and not
about a few weeks’ worth of discussions.
So what you are saying is that not only mathematics, history and
languages need to be focused on in school, but that morality, ethics
and religion need to be taught in a much greater scope.
Dalai Lama:
History, math, languages and economics – these are all subjects for the
brain. But responsibility – moral responsibilities, responsibilities
regarding society – these are things that come from the heart. This,
combined with the power of the brain, is what governments and large
companies need. I will give you an example: we Tibetans believe that
our national issue with China can only be resolved non-violently. This
is what we preach from Kindergarten onwards throughout the entire
education of an individual. When a Tibetan is confronted with a
conflict, his reaction should immediately be: “How can I resolve this
in dialogue?” It is important to us that young people in our schools
understand that violence is the wrong way, that violence cannot solve
problems. This attitude has become a part of many Tibetan’s lives
through education and training. The same needs to occur in regards to
economy and justice.
How many decades or centuries will it take until we are really ready for a “responsible free market economy”?
Dalai Lama:
This financial and economic crisis will help it to happen faster,
because those people who only think about money – even dream about it –
are affected the most by it. The crisis is terrible for many people,
but it also shows the value of money is limited and the insecurity is
huge. Inner values like friendship, trust, honesty and compassion are
much more reliable than money – they always bring happiness and
strength.
But only few people are promoted because they value friendship, trust and compassion. Isn’t your approach a little idealistic?
Dalai Lama:
What you are saying is one of the greatest contradictions. Those who
assert themselves often have very little morale, and those who have a
good sense of morale often don’t know how to assert themselves. This
problem, by the way, is much larger in socialism than in economics.
Often times the incompetent were leaders and governed and constricted
the competent. We saw what happens then. A company that behaves the
same way will fail because it wastes so much potential and will never
develop its own values.
Every good CEO has prerequisites for a suitable successor, yet
finding your successor is much more complicated and extensive. Do you
worry about it?
Dalai Lama:
No, it’s not so difficult. As a simple monk I don’t need a successor
when I die. And in regards to the role of the Dalai Lama as a
government leader: I ceded all of my governmental responsibilities
eight years ago – we have an elected government, so this is also not a
problem. This leaves the question of a successor of the Dalai Lama as a
spiritual leader. In 1969 I said the Tibetans need to decide themselves
whether there will be a 15th Dalai Lama. I gave suggestions, but I
cannot and do not want to get more involved than that.
Can you understand that leaders all over the world would like to
meet with you – but don’t – in order to prevent endangering their
economic relations with China?
Dalai Lama:
I think it is fine when a politician weighs all of the options and
comes to the decision that abides by the nation’s interest. However,
many politicians make it too easy for themselves – for them it is only
about their own companies earning as much money as possible. Is this a
terrible problem for me? Not really. My main interest is to promote
human values like harmony, responsibility and charity. To do so I need
to speak with people, not their leaders. If a government leader wants
to meet with me for spiritual reasons, I’d be glad to meet with them.
If they don’t, then they don’t, and there is no problem with that. I
don’t travel the world only for my people and the question of Tibet’s
future – I want to reach as many people as I can.
Will this century be marked by China’s ascent?
Dalai Lama:
China has developed enormous power. It is the evidence for how well an
economy can develop better under more freedom on a corporate level.
What China is missing, however, are values its society can rely on. The
standards that were relevant before the communist revolution are long
gone. And what has taken their place? Nothing but money. The communist
elite only think about power and money, and this can be very
destructive.
Religion, states and economy have grown increasingly apart. Do you
really believe that religious leaders such as yourself and the pope can
change the world for the better?
Dalai Lama:
I do not travel the world as a religious leader. I am a simple person,
a simple monk. Sure I have more opportunities because I am welcomed as
the Dalai Lama and because I have gathered a lot of experience in my 50
years of living in exile. These are experiences I can share with
people. But the moral principles we are talking about here give me an
inner strength, and inner strength gives me inner peace. This is how I
hope to reach out to people.
How do you feel about staying in five-star hotels when you travel abroad?
Dalai Lama:
To be honest, I don’t feel comfortable in large hotel rooms. Sometimes
I think there could be a ghost in the room (laughs). This is why I
always ask to be accommodated humbly and simply. I like places I stay
in to be modern, clean and comfortable. But most of the time I cannot
influence where I stay.
Don’t you get a guilty conscience when you stay in luxury accommodations?
Dalai Lama:
Why should I? When feel good, I can do more for others. But of course
it hurts me when I see poor people. Once when I was going to bed in
Vienna I saw a man lying on the street outside, and when I woke up in
the morning he was still there. I sent him fruits and bread; even
though I know it will only temporarily ease his agony.
When was the last time you were unfair or unjust?
Dalai Lama
(Thinks): Sometimes I lose my patience, but then I apologize. It happens sometimes.
You have written books about how damaging anger is, and still you get angry sometimes?
Dalai Lama:
Of course. It is not about eliminating anger, but rather finding the
cause for it and working against it. If you do not understand where the
anger comes from and don’t work against it, the anger will grow. Anger
is a destructive emotion which is based on arrogance. This is why one
must find the cause and counteract it.
You possess neither a credit card nor a bank account. Are there any
objects that you really need, ones that you can’t live without? Like
for example your home exercise equipment?
Dalai Lama:
No, there is nothing I can’t live without. I learned this attitude when I was a child.
